Star Trek XI. (Possible Spoilers)

monolith21 · May 8th, 2009, 09:47 PM

First, I'd like to say that I do not like remakes...re-imaginings, and rarely do I enjoy a reboot. I am not a "hybrid" fan of both Battlestar and Gino, and I will to my dying day proclaim that Han should always shoot first.

I have been on the fence from the beginning with this new Star Trek film. I am a lifelong Star Trek fan and I was not anxious to have someone mess with it. To me (and I'm sure a lot of you as well) the big three have always been Star Wars, Star Trek, and Battlestar. With that said...

I FREAKIN' LOVED THIS MOVIE!!!

I think it was exactly the shot of adrenaline that the franchise needed. Its a reboot in the sense that they are trying to bring Trek back to the masses. It is not a remake, and not a re-imagining. It is a sequel...100% It fits within continuity, and plays well within the Star Trek universe.

Don't get me wrong, there are some massive changes, but they are all part of the story and we are meant to feel the weight of those changes right along side the characters. Their world gets knocked to the ground, but in an interesting twist they don't go for the dark and gloomy spin. Instead, our heroes get back up and start dishing out a few punches of their own.

Amazing effects, great writing, fantastic acting (though some will never like the younger cast) and they nailed the spirit of Star Trek. Karl Urban went above and beyond in capturing Bones.

It was definitely not a "gino" for Star Trek. As a matter of fact, if this doesn't convince Hollywood that being respectful of long time fans and source material then nothing can. Because out side that Imax theatre I heard a kid say...and I quote..."I'm buying every single Star Trek DVD I can find". He had never even seen ANY incarnation of the show and now he's hooked. I hope if this new Battlestar movies happens, they take a note from JJ Abrams play book. He updated it and kept it true to form...and nailed it. Of course that is just my opinion.

I'll be seeing the film at least twice more in its run. If you can see it in Imax, do so!

-Mark

BST · May 8th, 2009, 10:45 PM

Not to split hairs but, it's not a sequel. It's a reboot.

However, I'm confident that we'll agree that it's a worthy successor to the Original Trek.

Aphrodite · May 9th, 2009, 02:16 AM

I thought it was a prequel.

monolith21 · May 9th, 2009, 04:07 AM

(I mean it folks, if you read on you could get some stuff spoiled! This is for those of us who have actually seen the movie...which you should do as well and in IMAX because it is rad...)

Hear me out on this one BST! I'm interested if you agree or dissagree with me on this.

Agreed it is a worthy successor, and even if it were a completely stand alone reboot I think it would be more respectful than certain other reboots. The film is 100% sequel. It is indeed a reboot of the series in the sense that it will now continue within the continuity of the altered time line. However, all that came before still happened before the time line was altered. Old Spock's existence within the altered time line is proof of that.

The time travel elements alter the "reality" of the characters early on...but regardless the antagonist's story begins post "Nemesis". Within minutes of arriving in the past the time line is altered.

Time travel stories and alternate realities are par for the course with Star Trek. This film was no more outside of the "rules" set up within continuity than "The Voyage Home" or "First Contact".

So yes, it is a reboot quite literally within the story. That does not change the fact that it is a sequel.

I think they did a great job providing a reason why things are different instead of just taking the easy way out and ignoring what came before. I think it was a bold move in today's market.

Don't get me wrong, if you go looking you'll find some things that don't jive. However, who knows how far the altered time line could have changed things.

On a seperate note completely, one thing I dug was how even though events change, certain things happen regardless. Might make for a good "destiny" take on things. For example Pike's fate was drastically changed and yet he still ended up in a wheel chair. Kirk's father wasn't around to inspire him into joining Starfleet and yet he was influenced to do so and became Captain of the Enterprise. I sort of took away from it that no matter how things change certain things are meant to be if we stay true to who we are.

Anyway....enough of this heavy stuff! lol

BST · May 9th, 2009, 07:39 PM

Monolith,

Logical, flawlessly logical.

Gemini1999 · May 9th, 2009, 11:06 PM

I haven't seen it yet. I'm not worried about spoilers, so don't worry about "ruining" it for me.

I've been hovering over this thing since Thursday night, but I just can't get wound up to see it. I probably will see an early matinee tomorrow morning, but I feel like I'm about to jump off the precipice of what Trek has been into what Trek may become.

It's a scary deal for me. I'll do it, but this is the first time that I didn't beat feet to my nearest theater at the earliest possible moment.

Bryan

monolith21 · May 10th, 2009, 03:54 AM

Your trepidation is warranted with the way movies have been going the last decade or so for sure! The studios have more than earned hesitance from science fiction fans.

In the beginning I was actually dead set against this thing. TOS is my favorite trek and I was not enjoying the idea of having anyone mess with it.

The minute I heard that Leonard Nimoy was going to be in it as Spock and would be playing a pivotal part within the story my curiosity was piqued.

I was on the fence until about two weeks ago. For some reason I just started to get really excited about it. I think it was the idea that they were going to use a stylized variant of TOS uniforms, and the sound effects were also stylized versions of their 1960's counterparts. I know, very small thing but I was just happy to see someone brave enough to see past the "we have to get rid of that look...its outdated" mentality. They brought the story to a modern audience with the feel of the original.

What a novel concept!

If this is where Star Trek is going, I'm alright with it. It wouldn't have been my first choice by far, but now that I've seen it I'm blown away. I'm absolutely ready for the sequel!

Gemini1999 · May 10th, 2009, 08:20 PM

I just got back from seeing the new film with much trepidation...

It's not Star Trek, at least not how I've come to know it. I know that will wind up becoming what Trek will be from this point on though. In some ways, I'm fine with it, but it just feels weird watching something with the Trek name on it that doesn't feel like it has a connection to the rest of it. I know that at the age of 48, I'm not in the target demographic and being a longtime Trek fan basically means I have two strikes against me.

There were small bits and pieces of it that I liked, but not enough to string them together and like the film as an overall experience. I feel like I did after seeing Indiana Jones IV, only more so.

My biggest gripes are with the general production design and the photography. The shaky-cam photography made some action scenes almost unintelligible. I did however, like the costumes used on the Kelvin and the "space jump" suits worn by Kirk and Sulu. I didn't see any ships that I would want to build a model of and the sets were largely forgettable.

The highlights of the film were mostly in terms of performances. Karl Urban was most definitely one of the standouts along with those of Bruce Greenwood as Pike and to some extent, both Pine as Kirk and and Qunto as Spock. Of course, seeing Leonard Nimoy in a Trek film was a plus - by the time he appeared, I'd given up hope on the film entirely. The worst bits for me were those with Anton Yelchin as Chekov and Simon Pegg as Scotty. I love Pegg - he's a terrific actor and a very funny guy in his own right, I just don't think that he was the best choice for this particular role. As for Yelchin, it's obvious that he can do a Russian accent, but the rest of it...not so much.

I know that the film is going to be successful and it's going to make Paramount/CBS a lot of money. That's what they wanted, they wanted a "tentpole" film to secure them for the summer and they got it. If money is the determining factor, then it looks like they've struck gold.

I know that it may not sound like it, but I'm glad that there's a large group of people enjoying the film. As I've said before, I don't think that I'd like the idea of seeing yet another Trek film tank like the last one did. I thought that we'd never see another one, yet here we are.

I still have 40 years worth of Trek material to keep me happy and I'm comfortable in that respect. Trek doesn't need me to keep it going. I will however, continue to actively support the fan produced Trek efforts. Fan series such as New Voyages/Phase II and Hidden Frontier keep me pretty sated in terms of getting my Trek fix. Someone earlier on mentioned folks having issues seeing other actors taking issue seeing familiar characters being played by unfamiliar actors, which has not been my problem in this case. Since I've been watching New Voyages, I've seen all the major roles in TOS played by other actors - one or two by more than one actor due to unexpected cast changes.

I guess that I'm just one of those older Trek fans watching the franchise pass me by.... If that's how I'll be characterized by how I feel, so be it.

Bryan

Darrell Lawrence · May 12th, 2009, 03:30 PM

Interesting commentaries on the film. If you're worried about posting a spoiler or two though, use the spoiler tags

Kronus · May 12th, 2009, 04:56 PM

Okay, for those of you who have been here long enough knows that my old User ID I logged in here with was KlingonGeneral and my avatar at the time was me in my Klingon outfit, ridges and all. So I do love the Star Trek Universe to say the least.

Now I totally agree with Monolith on seeing this movie at the nearest IMAX you can get to. This movie just rocked in the huge screen and awesome sound system.

Now as for the story...timelines, I hate them with a passion. If any universe has out played them it is Star Trek. The timeline episodes are my least favorite and I rarely re-watch them. As for this "re-boot", I have to admit that this was the only time I truly felt the timeline bit was appropriate.

It was the logical approach in getting the "old school Trekkies" to sign off on it and to eventually adopt it. Even though we could pick it apart in many instances, this was the only way I would have been able to "accept" many of the changes that took place. Remember the ST Universe changed in the first 15 minutes of the movie...instantly. So everything we knew was no longer valid...with some exceptions that Monolith so eloquently stated already.

I felt the actors did an overall great job in their roles and I enjoyed the new outlook of the young Kirk to the twenty something Kirk.

Uhura and Spock were a shock to me and it has taken me a few days to let what we had discovered about them to sink in bit. Again, the timeline changed in the first 15 minutes of the movie.

My wife isn't into Sci/Fi like me, (well a lot are not into Sci/Fi like me lol!), yet she really did enjoy this movie.

I look forward to the next movie or series (hopefully).

Damocles · May 12th, 2009, 06:12 PM

COMMENT:

After what Berman did to the Franchise and the house cleaning and fumigation necessary, to clean out Paramount after they kicked him off the lot; what else could Adams do? At least now there may be NO Picard.,

Darrell Lawrence · May 12th, 2009, 06:14 PM

Picard was Gene's creation, not Bermans

Damocles · May 12th, 2009, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warrior

Picard was Gene's creation, not Bermans

Not after Season Two he wasn't.

Darrell Lawrence · May 12th, 2009, 09:41 PM

Picard will always be Gene's creation.

Berman extended the character later maybe, but nothing can change the fact Gene created him

Gemini1999 · May 12th, 2009, 10:55 PM

Hello?

I thought that we were talking about the new film, not tearing down TNG or whatever. I wasn't that impressed by Trek XI, but I'd rather read about that instead of reading posts where people are slagging each other off over Trek trivia.

Besides, Darrell is correct - the character of Picard was created by Gene Roddenberry. Now, after a certain point, the development of that character was in different hands, but that's another story for another time and another thread.

monolith21 · May 13th, 2009, 01:49 AM

Bryan, you got me thinking about something. For the first time in a long time with a Star Trek film or show, I wasn't all that focused on the costumes, sets, props, or gadgets in general. The story is what got me. That is saying something because I tend to focus on all those things more than I probably should! lol

In all fairness, TOS was my favorite incarnation of Star Trek (films included). It might be a completely different experience if your favorite series was The Next Generation or any of the following versions.

I avoided as much of the hype on this film as possible. Aside from a look at the costumes and the Enterprise I stayed completely clear of any information in order to come at it with a fresh mind. With the way things have been handled with so many of my other favorites I did have some trepidation, but no preconceived notions regarding the film. I knew people that were set to hate this six months before it ever hit a screen. I can identify. Nothing short of a miracle could get me to like Gino.

I'm happy to see it doing so well. Heck, I'm digging seeing Star Trek toy commercials on TV and kids running around playing Star Trek at work! I actually had a conversation about Star Trek with an eight year old today and I couldn't honestly tell you who was more excited! lol

Damocles · May 13th, 2009, 01:26 PM

I was just happy that JJ Adams did this:

That means Picard does NOT exist.

Kronus · May 13th, 2009, 04:50 PM

Ah D, you trouble maker!

Gemini1999 · May 13th, 2009, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kronus

Ah D, you trouble maker!

Couldn't have said it better myself...

BST · May 13th, 2009, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monolith21

In all fairness, TOS was my favorite incarnation of Star Trek (films included). It might be a completely different experience if your favorite series was The Next Generation or any of the following versions.

It was for me, too. Granted, they didn't have all the real fancy effects that are widespread, today but, it didn't matter. What mattered was the story.

Some examples were scenes like

Spock and McCoy listening to Kirk's "last orders" in 'The Tholian Web'

Kirk reflecting on the final confrontation on Organia and feeling embarassed about his fury toward the Organians for stopping a conflict that he really didn't want

Kirk's anguish after preventing McCoy from saving Edith Keeler

Kirk reflecting on the personal, eternal hell that would be shared by Lazarus and Lazarus, in "The Alternative Factor"

Kirk and McCoy discussing what would be happening on the planet now that "they would be making serpents for the Garden of Eden", in "A Private Little War"

There's many more but, you get the idea. If the story is sound, it really doesn't matter about the effects.... they're only there to add to the story, not to be the story.

That's what I believe happened to Trek, in the later shows... too much focus on the "sizzle" and not enough focus on the "steak".

monolith21 · May 14th, 2009, 12:48 AM

Exactly. Some of the later shows and films just became so self referencing that the stories began to become a little less interesting. I think this is definitely what lead to a reboot of sorts. I'm glad they did it the way they did. I was worried they were just going to act like nothing came before.

Damocles · May 14th, 2009, 10:25 AM

Let's face it. BST and Monolith just resaid what I have against Berman Drek(TM) and for the TOS. Maybe I have a bete noire about Pickacardanycard in particular, (actor, character, incompetent back-story, etc.) but I have a lot of heartburn with ST/TNG, Voyager, and Enterprise. Not so much with DS9, because Captain Psycho ran a tight ship and that was a tight series.

I don't know what happened to Gene in his dotage, but you can't excuse that mess (ST:TNG); or the choice HE made for a Captain and that "vision".

https://www.friesian.com/trek.htm

The Federation he created then and that Berman corrupted is NOT the Federation of Kirk.

That Picard Federation had to die.

Amd I'm glad its DEAD.

Bring on the new timeline!

martok2112 · May 16th, 2009, 05:44 AM

The first fifteen minutes of this movie (the entirety of which I enjoyed enough to go see four times) is some of the most powerful Star Trek since the ending of The Wrath of Khan. Each and every time I saw the opening of the new movie, it took everything I had to fight back tears. It was so beautifully played out...and the music only accentuated it.

I loved the "buddy movie" styled humor between Kirk and McCoy during a couple of sequences in the movie. Their shenanigans had the audience belly laughing. And it was good humor. It wasn't like taking Starsky and Hutch, or Land of the Lost, and turning it into a blatant comedy, which is the fate of many 70's shows getting remade into feature films.

There was even a "buddy movie" styled moment between Kirk and Spock that again had the audience laughing appreciatively, not derisive.

Awww....heck.......(to be continued)

martok2112 · May 16th, 2009, 05:45 AM

Here's my review...

FILM: STAR TREK
DISTRIBUTOR: PARAMOUNT
DIRECTOR: J.J. ABRAMS
PRINCIPAL CAST: CHRIS PINE, ZACHARY QUINTO, ZOE SALDANA, KARL URBAN, BRUCE GREENWOOD, ERIC BANA, JOHN CHO, ANTON YELCHIN, SIMON PEGG, LEONARD NIMOY
MPAA RATING: PG-13 for SCI FI ACTION AND VIOLENCE, AND BRIEF SEXUAL CONTENT (reviewer's note: also brief mild language)
RUNTIME: 2hrs., 6mins.

Story: 4.5/5
Acting: 5/5
Sound: 5/5
Visuals: 5/5
Endorphin Factor: 4/5
Big Screen Experience: 5/5
Scoring system:
Average: 4.75/ 5

MOVIES IT COULD BE COMPARED TO: Any previous Star Trek film

DETAILS: Well, it looks like J.J. Abrams and his boys at Bad Robot have done it. Star Trek is officially, and quite satisfactorily rebooted for a new generation of fans, as well as fans of Trek come before.

This is sort of a how Kirk met everybody else story, and along with it is a great thrill ride.

I will admit, I wish there could've been just a bit more backstory to the main villain, one Romulan Captain Nero (played well by Eric Bana).

The story itself is very fast paced and starts off with an action sequence that actually had me almost in tears, given the nature of its resolution.

We are then treated to a quick backstory of James Tiberius Kirk, and Spock, and their troubled youth which will set the stage for their future exploits.

The movie moves along at a great clip, and never fails to entertain. Even at its slowest moments (of which there are very few) the movie holds your attention...especially with the presence of Leonard Nimoy. I do believe though that movie sometimes moved along just a little too quick. It was over before I knew it, and that's saying something for a movie with a 126 minute run time.

There are a few things that purists might say were wrong, and even my red flag got set off on occasion, but certainly not enough to detract from my enjoyment of the film. This is a complete reboot, yet there is some continuity/minor paradox that is logically handled for the story. While the characters stay true (largely) to their original iconic incarnations, these versions do have enough liberty to keep them fresh and interesting for today's audience. That is NOT saying that the characters are dumbed down. Refreshed does not mean that at all.

The visual effects of this film were stunning, as was the sound mix. My only minor gripe is that I wish they could've given the Enterprise just a wee bit more of a treatment from Star Trek The Motion Picture. As such, the introduction of the Enterprise felt just a tiny bit rushed. Again, such a minor complaint is hardly cause for me to completely dismiss the film. The lovely lady of the stars gets plenty of screentime, and she is worth watching every single second.

The story is tightly written, and is filled with action, humor, sadness, joy, defeat, and triumph, as well as the sense of wonder of a new beginning. There are plenty of nods for old Trek fans like myself, and they are certainly not going to be lost on potential new fans from this generation. Technobabble is kept to a minimum, but when it is used, it is used effectively.

The actors ALL turn in top notch performances. Zachary Quinto does an excellent job of straddling the emotional line inherent to Spock's half-breed nature. Chris Pine plays a fine, cocky, tongue in cheek Kirk that also has Kirk's better nature of command blossom out. Karl Urban as McCoy....I think DeForest Kelley would smile on him proudly. John Cho and Anton Yelchin do great respect to their roles, if also a bit tongue in cheek. Simon Pegg is hilarious as Scotty, but is also the miracle worker that we've come to know and love. A couple of self-surprised moments for the newcoming engineer really endear Scotty to the audience. Eric Bana's character, the Romulan Nero, almost has a feel of Shinzon from Nemesis....a little more fleshing out of the character's backstory would've been welcome, but Bana turns in a good, menacing performance. Zoe Saldana is very beautiful, and very charming as Uhura...and she is a character every bit as dignified and respectable as Nichelle Nichols' original version.

Some surprises in this movie, but none I will spoil. They are best experienced unspoiled, for the viewer to evaluate for themselves. As with all things in this movie, I found them refreshing.

This movie on all levels had a far more epic feel than any previous Star Trek film.

BOTTOM LINE: Go see Star Trek. It's a great reboot, and one that does far more respect for the original series than some of its premature detractors give it credit for.