10: War Of The Gods

[KJ]

Yeah i read that one and told ya so remember?

One of weird things of Galactica was that they never took on more humans that they came across. especially considering the fact the Cylon Empire recently conquered them and destroyed their colonies. One day the Cylons are bound to takeover the planet where Apollo met Vella and Puppis. How was Apollo ever going to meet them again if he's on a quest to find Earth which could be many lights years away?

Thats why many episodes of Galactica beg to be continued in one form or another.

Thing is, will fan stories ever get to be published big time! Thats the problem, reading fantastic stories better than whats on television at the moment knowing in your heart of hearts it ain't ever going to be reaching alot of folks outside of fandom.

And god knows when it comes to reading fanfics, i've barely touched the surface myself?

KJ

[Eric Paddon]

I think on the matter of not taking on other humans, it's ultimately more a case of Adama recognizing that the humans who have established themselves in their out of the way outposts have a right to control their own destinies, especially if there isn't a danger of immediate Cylon extermination so long as the Fleet gets out of the region fast enough so that the Cylons would never have reason to scout that area. And that given how "Free will" is such a valued concept as the SOL beings indicated in WOTG, I think Adama's sense of values would be that only those who *want* to join the Fleet should come along.

That Lost Warrior sequel was so long ago, I'd forgotten, but thank you again for reading it! In fact, writing that story way back when is one reason why I've put off doing my adaptation of the original story (one of three I've still yet to do).

Truthfully, I wish that the guidelines for publishing Galactica stories were as easy as it's been for Star Trek TOS over the years. We've seen so many stories, none of which have to conform to a solitary universe of action over the years, and Galactica would lend itself perfectly to that as well (as opposed to Star Wars where everything that gets published has t conform to a single universe) since the beauty of how "Hand Of God" ends is that it's on an open note of upbeat optimism where there are all kinds of directions to go in. Alas, the hang-up would appear to be Universal which came up with strict standards just to let Hatch publish his novels that it would be even more difficult to get the rights to do so today, and even then they would probably not loosen the floodgages to let different authors write their own interpretations of the future.

Galactica has been blest to have the richest level of creative output I've ever seen for any show on the net, and it is indeed unfortunate that we're hindered from increasing awareness of it. Alas, some of that also has to do with the fact that "fanfic" too often receives a negative stigma because there is a bad element of it in so many quarters devoted to the tasteless "slash" genre that ultimately makes many people in general think of fanfic as the outlet for deranged people rather than the kind of amateur creative output where one can find better results than in many "professional" areas just like one can sometimes hear a more gifted musician in their local church than at Carnegie Hall.

[KJ]

Originally Posted by Eric Paddon

Truthfully, I wish that the guidelines for publishing Galactica stories were as easy as it's been for Star Trek TOS over the years. We've seen so many stories, none of which have to conform to a solitary universe of action over the years, and Galactica would lend itself perfectly to that as well (as opposed to Star Wars where everything that gets published has t conform to a single universe) since the beauty of how "Hand Of God" ends is that it's on an open note of upbeat optimism where there are all kinds of directions to go in. Alas, the hang-up would appear to be Universal which came up with strict standards just to let Hatch publish his novels that it would be even more difficult to get the rights to do so today, and even then they would probably not loosen the floodgages to let different authors write their own interpretations of the future.

Galactica has been blest to have the richest level of creative output I've ever seen for any show on the net, and it is indeed unfortunate that we're hindered from increasing awareness of it. Alas, some of that also has to do with the fact that "fanfic" too often receives a negative stigma because there is a bad element of it in so many quarters devoted to the tasteless "slash" genre that ultimately makes many people in general think of fanfic as the outlet for deranged people rather than the kind of amateur creative output where one can find better results than in many "professional" areas just like one can sometimes hear a more gifted musician in their local church than at Carnegie Hall.

It's B.S. that Universal would even treat their own creation like that!

And even more weird to try and comprehend them for NOT taking advantage of Battlestar Galactica for the past 25 plus years before the new remake series came about. Yeah i do indeed see that Star Trek has more free reign to create stories whereas Star Wars became more restricted overtime (especially when the prequels came into existance?)

But at least they're both considered the biggest science fiction franchises out there and both Paramount and 20th Century Fox took full advantage of what they own in their studios. Same can be said for MGM which own the James Bond 007 and Stargate licenses two of their biggest franchises which also churn out very sellable novels if i'm not mistaken. Stargate even has blatant novel series that follows the continuity of both the TV series and the original movie. And me being a fan of the movie version, i know which ones i have to find? I kinda wish as a B5 fan that Warner Brothers could have done far more to sell Babylon 5 to the public when it was there on TV and cable/satellite when Warners had the chance. But Babylon 5 is big enough and has certainly carved out a nice history of its own to also produce a slew of novels in shops which are there today in many specialist book shops!

And as of today you'll probably have Firefly/Serenity and Star Trek Enterprise putting out novels for sci-fi buffs to lap up. which is all good.

But Battlestar Galactica sure is a wasted opportunity for Universal. And i'm sure even the dumbest executive studio bigwigs in Uni's boardrooms know of that fact by now. They can lie their heads off all they want till they're blue in the face, but surely after the recent DVD sales of the classic series. They must be thinking what they were originally sitting on was a "Goldmine!" that needed to be revived with at least a series of novels if not a new ongoing original TV series.

Fanfics or stories commissioned by Universal and done by professional writers is the route if any future revival doesn't actually happen though.

And yes, i'd hope that such classic Battlestar Galactica tales like War Of The Gods does get that sequel story. It needs to be told, and if a revival of Galactica happened on the big screen, then i'd like to see WOTG be done as the sequel movie a la "Wrath Of Khan" style. Taking an episode(s) from the original TV series and making a multi-million dollar blockbuster out of it!

And as we all know. Movies get expanded novel adaptations. And they lead to others being made down the line.

KJ

[Eric Paddon]

It's a good suggestion, and if the standards were made loose enough for maximum participation, I'm sure it would get an enthusiastic reception. The sticky point might be that the Powers That Be who would conceivably grant permission for new novels would try to offer a "business" explanation that having multiple universes of stories would confuse the uninitiated too much, but frankly I don't see how that's ever hurt any of the Trek novels. When you buy the Trek novel on how Khan rose to power in the 1990s, are you instinctively going to be dissuaded from buying another Trek novel where that course of events didn't happen in that other author's universe? Wouldn't stop me!

Universal's treatment of Galactica can best be summarized, "Never has so little been done for something that deserved so much!"

[KJ]

Agreed!

The needs to be stated and outlined in "bold" though.

Like this...

Universal's treatment of Galactica can best be summarized, "Never has so little been done for something that deserved so much!"

KJ

[Senmut]

Hey, LKJ, ever mosied on over and taken a peek at the VS2?

[KJ]

Eh? If you care to elaborate on what VS2 means then i'd know?


KJ

[Senmut]

Virtual Season 2.

To be found at https://www.galacticafanfic.com/stories/season2.html

[KJ]

Oh yeah, Paddon showed me that stuff a while back. Believe there was one script that was supposed to be a sequel to War Of The Gods i took a look at "The Derelict" as well as "Two For Twilly" etc.

KJ

[KJ]

Originally Posted by Eric Paddon

Truthfully, I wish that the guidelines for publishing Galactica stories were as easy as it's been for Star Trek TOS over the years. We've seen so many stories, none of which have to conform to a solitary universe of action over the years, and Galactica would lend itself perfectly to that as well (as opposed to Star Wars where everything that gets published has t conform to a single universe) since the beauty of how "Hand Of God" ends is that it's on an open note of upbeat optimism where there are all kinds of directions to go in. Alas, the hang-up would appear to be Universal which came up with strict standards just to let Hatch publish his novels that it would be even more difficult to get the rights to do so today, and even then they would probably not loosen the floodgages to let different authors write their own interpretations of the future.

Thats the real pity of it all.

So much could've been put into novel format for BG to further its fictional universe akin to both Star Trek and Star Wars and every other sci-fi property that continues its stories far beyond a TV series or big budget theatrical movie. I also think its a huge pity, that the several unfilmed Battlestar Galactica scripts weren't made into novels following on from the published Berkerly BSG books.

We're missing out aren't we?

KJ

[Senmut]

Missing out, big time.
Since YOU have a good take on what BSG was, is, and ought to be, ever think of trying your hand at adding to the VS?

[KJ]

I did a What if' "Season By Season" outline years ago on Skiffy. Thats thats only thing, i'd ever want to truly update now for everybody to read up on. It might be good for for Virtual season guide, or possibly given to Tom DeSanto for his BG movie ideas etc.

Let ya know real soon when i get my internet connection restored Senmut. Right now, i'm on a touch-&-go basis, which is kinda of a bummer. Hopefully i'll be back soon full time.

Laters.

KJ

[Athene]

I was watching The War of the Gods the other night. I really like this episode.
I think it would be neat to bring back Count Iblis and this time Adama could have beaten the frack out of him.

[Athene]

Originally Posted by Lord Kingjason

I did a What if' "Season By Season" outline years ago on Skiffy. Thats thats only thing, i'd ever why to truly update now for everybody. it might be good for for Virtual season guide, or possibly given to Tom DeSanto for his BG movie ideas etc.

Let ya know real soon when i get my internet connection restored Senmut. Right now, i'm on a touch-&-go basis, which is kinda of a bummer. Hopefully i'll be back soon full time.

Laters.

KJ

Hope you internet connection has gotten fixed.
I know what it's like when the connection is down. One time my connection was down for a couple of days!

[Senmut]

I would like to know more about the precepts that guide the SOL Beings, and why some "interference" is allowed, and other is not.
A complex code, no doubt.

[Captain Chirri]

A while back, I ran across a fanfic on some site or other, where the plotline was a cross between BG and V: the TV series.

The upshot was, the Visitors were the last descendants of the original Cylon race. Their ancestors, after being mostly massacred by their robotic creations, made the same kind of exodus that the humans of the Twelve Colonies did, and hotfooted it across the galaxies until they reached the planet Sirius.

Unfortunately, I didn't read the fic in depth, so I can't remember more than that.

I know that the A-Team showed up, and had Face and Starbuck in the same room at some point. (I gotta find it again and read the whole thing!)

That gave me the seed of an idea for a fic of my own concerning the Cylons/Sirians, but I have to find my notes before I start blabbing about it here.

As to the episode, there were a few glaring plot holes that were never closed up, but overall I thought it was enjoyable.

The one thing that bugged me was the fact that we never saw the inside of the spaceship that Iblis was on, nor did we get a look at the crew.

Also, the age difference between him and Sheba was a bit much for me to take in.

It would have made more sense for a somewhat younger, and better looking actor, playing the vulnerability card to cozy up to her, and make her fall for him.

Not that Patrick MacNee is bad looking; but he didn't have that kind of 'oomph' and animal magnetism that a younger man would have had in the role.


As to who that could have been? I have no clue. I don't remember a lot of actors from the late Seventies very well.

Maybe someone here can come up with something.

[KJ]

I know, in comparison to Space 1999's first season BG and alot of Amercian sci-fi shows, lack any real graphic scenes of horror whereas Space 1999 looking back now made some pretty brave choices in its storytelling when revelations came pouring in far as the dangers of being out there in space with all its unknown elements flying about the place.

The Wrecked ship of Iblis as always meant to have a shocking revelation (dead demons) but the Execs and ABC chickened out at the last minute.

I'd kill for Universal to do to BG what Paramount done for the original Star Trek series and give us a Remastered series of classic BG and finally give us SE of the Galactica episodes the series would grow and benefit from. WOTG would only be truly seen it was always meant to be, from a major SFX spruce up and if all that deleted footage of the 'cloven hooves' exist today, then we'd get a director's cut of this classic episode then.

Far as what could've been...

I consider Adam Stacey's BG fanfic second season stories to be what Larson and co might've done with a sequel to War Of The Gods.

Giving Iblis' minions an actual name ("Satyr League") and their conflict with the Colonials and Cylons is something i imagined a 2nd season of BG might've gone in.

KJ

[Captain Chirri]

I'd like to see that too, but unfortunately, the PowersThatBe probably don't see any money in it, so they ain't gonna do it.

[KJ]

Then its left to the fans to envision that through "KILLER" fanedits!!!

Originally Posted by senmut

I would like to know more about the precepts that guide the SOL Beings, and why some "interference" is allowed, and other is not. A complex code, no doubt.

Like most powerful beings in science fiction, there are certain rules and most higher beings follow these in sci-fi, thus the drama comes from stopping certain renagades from causing major amounts of chaos. Although over the past 10 years or so they gone from; 'Good' Vs 'Evil' to 'Not-So-Good' Higher Beings, to outright evil tyrants etc.

The lines are blured nower days! In order to find a new twist in storytelling potential.

KJ

[AJMarks]

After some thinking I'd like to see Ilbis have some depth. It's the one thing that bothered me a lot about these episodes. I'd like to know what his goal is, and that can be gained by expanding who the beings of light are and their relationship with Ilbis. Are they the same race, difference races or is one the creation of the other?

I'd also remove the scene where Balter says he knows that voice, I never like it. I always thought Larson put that in because Baltar knows evil, is evil he recoginized evil in Ilbis.

[Captain Chirri]

I always thought that they were guardian angels of some kind. They couldn't interfere directly, because they can't stop the exercise of Free Will and all that. Not even Iblis'. By the same token, he can't stop them from keeping an eye on him or at least trying to.

I remember reading Richard Hatch's book, and the back story for Iblis portrays him as someone like the Biblical Cain, who was jealous of his younger brother, and became a very hateful being, even towards his own family.

He went to the Cylon homeworld, and through genetic engineering and cybernetics, created the first mechanical Cylons.

When he died, he simply became worst, as his evil traits were magnified.

His son eventtually went on to found the House of Baltar, and his brother founded the House of Adama.

So, it's a family thing for Iblis.

By destroying, or corrupting his brother's descendants, he can finally feel superior to him and rub his nose in it.

All of his childish insecurities were also magnified, because let's face it; he's been throwing a temper tantrum for 1000 yahrens, and making everyone else miserable.

[KJ]

So much could've been done with BSG, that its a crying shame to this day considering how many shows copy and ape the same kinda 'mish-mash' of mythology mixed in with science fiction!

So much of the interesting elements of Galactica weren't even touched upon!

- What was in the wrecked ship? (*Revelation cut* and scene deleted by censors!)

- Who exactly were onboard (Iblis' people or innocents human/aliens he came across that he intended to trick and enslave, as Adama finally and subtly referenced somewhat?)

- How big was the crashed ship and what did it ever look like? Was it a warship, civilian transport, cruiser etc?

- Was Count Iblis' comments about there being far more dangerous and powerful enemies than the Cylons and their allies combined. Was he actually refering to his possible; brothers and sisters out in the universe from the lightship/BOL, who also turned renegade?!

Akin to Satan, who was thrown out of heaven with one third (3rd) of the angels who turned against god in the Old Testament! (Larson's a mormon and was trying to tie mythology and biblical events into his stories on BSG. Was he really trying to set up other confrontations much later on, with more of Iblis' kind/race?)

- The Lords Of Kobol (who were they exactly if BSG as a series, "pooled in" all kinds of motifs and references to ancient Earth cultures etc) 'Sagan', and the 'Ninth Lord' (LPOTG)

Iblis knows of them?

- The Reptillian Cylons and their fate 1.000 years/Yarens earlier. Its known that Count Iblis was involved, but that the origin Cylons were an aggressive race bent on conquering all other races and that there own greed led to their destruction.

- What is John's major role as one of the BOL?

- The fate of the 'Battlestar Pegasus'!

- Lunar 7 and rest of the 'Western Nationists' from planet Terra! And who exactly is this famed 'Charlie Watts'.

- Did Colonel Croft, the sole survivor of the Arcta mission (with possible exception to Wolfe) do in the Rag Tag fleet afterwards?!

- Earth transmissions in HOG. Would there have been much more as the series continued.

- Wolfe's fate after he ran away into the snow capped blizzard on Arcta. Did he reach one of the Cylon fighters/Transports and escape? If so what became of him since he didn't die onscreen.

And a host of other questions we all keep asking as fans of the series!


KJ

[Captain Chirri]

Never mind copy; some shows outright rip it off!

There were a lot of unanswered questions with this series, due to the fact that it ran for only one year.

I figure that John was one of the BOL, who took on human form so that communication between him, Apollo and later Starbuck would be easier. Let's face it, you're more comfortable dealing with someone who at least appears to be human, instead of an incorporeal angel. They kinda tend to freak people out.

They could have done so much more with it, but because of budget constraints, along with the chicken-poop execs at the studio, they were stuck.

But, there is hope.

That is what fanfic is all about, especially with series that were cut off before they reached their prime.

I've read some of the stuff that's in the library, and am very impressed by it.

I love the crossovers, and am working on one myself.

I need a beta reader though, someone who is more familiar with BG than I am. That person also has to be a fan of Harry Potter, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and at least have a working knowledge of the characters, if not the situations.

[Captain Chirri]

There's a few things about the episode that bug me, now that I think on it.

For one, choosing Patrick Macnee for the part.

To whit: They should have used someone younger and better looking for the part. I could definitely see a young George Clooney in the role. A real smooth-talking, nummy looking guy with big brown eyes, thick dark hair, and a little boy smile that makes a woman's furnace go WHOOMP!

Don't get me wrong, Patrick is a good actor, but what in the seven Hells did Sheba SEE in him?

Me, I look at him back then, and think the same thing that I do now about him; Meh!

[Lara]

Originally Posted by Captain Chirri

There's a few things about the episode that bug me, now that I think on it.

For one, choosing Patrick Macnee for the part.

Don't get me wrong, Patrick is a good actor, but what in the seven Hells did Sheba SEE in him?

Me, I look at him back then, and think the same thing that I do now about him; Meh!

I think she fell for the powerful father figure. Having lost Cain she was vulnerable to needing a replacement. Iblis was charming and non threatening in that he wasn't chasing skirt!
Also Iblis was an 'alternative' to Adama or the council. He would have been easier to dismiss if he had been a direct challenge to Starbuck (or Apollo)

On a more practical side, TV at the time was transitioning, and the inclusion of important guest actors of note was still part of the production techniques. TOS had far more of its fair share of 'notable' actors than its critics give it credit for. Only now is it cool to cast unknowns, then it was staple to have household names as 'guest stars'

Cheers,
Lara

[Athene]

Originally Posted by Lara

I think she fell for the powerful father figure. Having lost Cain she was vulnerable to needing a replacement. Iblis was charming and non threatening in that he wasn't chasing skirt!
Also Iblis was an 'alternative' to Adama or the council. He would have been easier to dismiss if he had been a direct challenge to Starbuck (or Apollo)

On a more practical side, TV at the time was transitioning, and the inclusion of important guest actors of note was still part of the production techniques. TOS had far more of its fair share of 'notable' actors than its critics give it credit for. Only now is it cool to cast unknowns, then it was staple to have household names as 'guest stars'

Cheers,
Lara

I agree. I also very much liked his voice. It drew you in. An older man can indeed be very, very charming.

hmm.. a challenge to Apollo or Starbuck? now's there's an interesting thought..

[LZaza]

Originally Posted by Lara

I think she fell for the powerful father figure. Having lost Cain she was vulnerable to needing a replacement. Iblis was charming and non threatening in that he wasn't chasing skirt!
Also Iblis was an 'alternative' to Adama or the council. He would have been easier to dismiss if he had been a direct challenge to Starbuck (or Apollo)

On a more practical side, TV at the time was transitioning, and the inclusion of important guest actors of note was still part of the production techniques. TOS had far more of its fair share of 'notable' actors than its critics give it credit for. Only now is it cool to cast unknowns, then it was staple to have household names as 'guest stars'

Cheers,
Lara

The ironic thing about how Iblis "wasn't chasing skirt" was that Starbuck and even Apollo certainly thought that he was. And even Sheba was using her liaison with Iblis to make Apollo jealous. So while Iblis obviously wasn't interested in Sheba sexually, the other characters thought he was. A younger actor--someone mentioned George Clooney-- wouldn't have been able to pull that portrayal off as effectively.

[Senmut]

Agreed. Iblis sized Sheba up quickly, and recognized all her vulnerabilities.
But then he's had millenia to hone his technique.