BSG Mini

Moore and SCIFI will probably make or break Galactica's future.

People had said for years that a Galactica fan base was out there and you can make money if you bring it back. It may or may not be the version you want but this was the gamble the money people thought best.

If a mini based series succeeds "Battlestar Galactica" in a year or so will be to most people the mini based series. TOS will be the "old Galactica". If the mini based series fails "Battlestar Galactica" will have failed to the money people.

The mini version may not be your best choice but the franchise will live or die based on it. I would start sending story and character ideas to Moore and SCIFI. All the negative response they get if they greenlight the series will only help to kill the Galactica franchise.

Any Galactica series based on the mini is a blank slate. There is no "In Harm's Way" II for Moore to reimagine. Many of you say Moore has done some good work in the past so I hope he does us well in the future.

I think Moore has an opportunity to remake the best of TOS (like the Pegasus story), ignore the worst (like the casino planet), and give us some original work.

If greenlighted we will have in reality a pro-franchise camp and an anti-franchise camp not a pro and anti "mini" camp.

The situation isn't "perfect" but it's more than we had two years ago. Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water.

[SAR Pilot]

Antelope, I couldn't have said it better myself! ! !

The next round is on me!

Originally posted by Dawg
OK, Eskimo, I understand - you were doing a "what if". "What if" ST:TOS were alive and well in the movies at the same time a remade series appeared on TV, with the same characters but different actors.

I agree - it would be too confusing and nobody would like it.

But that's not what happened to Star Trek

Ah! Finally. Someone finally understands what I was trying to say. And it was the Dawg. Now Dawg I enjoyed the debat and some points you made were I think well thought out. A countinuation of TOS would have been fine if not for the mini and might have made it with a new fan based but alas it was not meant to be. Because as many have said, the mini is now the life or death of BSG. I know Star Trek went in a different direction but it was only used as an example because it was something I knew everyone could relate to and understand. But I thnk it is time for this thread to come to an end and move on to other debates. Happy Posting


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion"

[SAR Pilot]

Eskimo,

I understood the words that were coming out of your mouth! From the beginning, even!

[BST]

But I thnk it is time for this thread to come to an end and move on to other debates. Happy Posting

Now wait a "dawg-gone" minute!!

I have a "bone to pick" with the following:

Originally posted by antelope526

The mini version may not be your best choice but the franchise will live or die based on it.

I respectfully disagree with this assessment and the reason for my disagreement is due to the mediums in which the mini-series was produced and in which a potential continuation movie would be produced.

The mini-series was aired on a cable television network which is NOT available to ALL potential viewers.
The movie would be available to ALL potential movie goers.

If the mini-series had been produced for one of the major networks which, of course, have a larger potential audience then, there may be some correlation as to how well a theatre-based movie will do. At this point, there really is no true correlation. The only meaningful data that can be gleaned from the mini-series ratings, etc, is whether or not it will provide Sci-Fi enough momentum to take the next step, whatever that happens to be -- weekly series, periodic mini-series event, etc.

It's been stated before that the possibility of a theatre-based movie is NOT dependent on the success or failure of the mini-series. That is a true statement because the main ingredient necessary for a movie will be whether or not there is INTEREST in the Battlestar Galactica franchise. That's all that will be of interest to potential backers of this type of project.

BST

Your just plain wrong, and a TOS movie will prove that!

Originally posted by originalsinner
Your just plain wrong, and a TOS movie will prove that!

And your claims are not more than mere idle speculation how? Where is this "TOS movie" that has proven anything?

[Soulmage]

Unfortunately, its true.

If the misi-series dies, it takes with it the last vestiges of hope for any incarnation of the Galactica Series.

The folks making these decisions don't see a TOS/Mini difference. They just see "Battlestar Galactica" and how profitable the franchise appears to be.

Like it or not, the original series and any possibile continuation were gone forever the day the new mini aired.

Nobody is going to blow $100 million making a movie of the original series version if a very expensive TV version of the same thing failed to be picked up. (Yes, it would cost $100 million or more to make a movie if you're going to be at all competitive in today's movie environment.)

Even if it were possible in some universe that a TOS-style movie would be made. . . guess what, its not going to be a continuation either. Nobody is going to produce a movie that relies on people recalling plot elements of a TV show 25 years old. What you would get is another re-make/re-imagining that may be more or less palatable based on your individual taste.

Just look at every decades-old series that has been made into a movie. Lost in Space, Charlie's Angels, even when the 1st Star Trek movie came out, you didn't really need to know anything about the old series. The new movie was self-contained (and bad).

Doing a movie where we jump into things (. . . people are on the run from the alien machine race why?) is not a realistic hope, nor would it be a very compelling story to the average viewer if the destruction of the colonies isn't used as the emotional hammer that grabs you up-front as it has to be with the BSG concept.

[Soulmage]

I should add that personally I'd be fine with two BSG series running concurrently (as long as they didn't schedule them opposite each other!) Or one series and one movie, whatever. There's just not enough enjoyable sci-fi out there.

I just also understand that it won't happen.

[Dawg]

Originally posted by Soulmage
I should add that personally I'd be fine with two BSG series running concurrently (as long as they didn't schedule them opposite each other!) Or one series and one movie, whatever. There's just not enough enjoyable sci-fi out there.

I just also understand that it won't happen.

And just where did you get your crystal ball, Soulmage?

Very true - there is no contract signed - but there is someone who has purchased (i.e. spent real money on) the feature film rights who wants to bring back the original BSG universe (that would be Glen Larson). There is also a big-time producer who has repeatedly expressed an interest in doing a feature that would bring back the original BSG universe, and, in fact, had such a production underway before it was unceremoniously yanked out from under him (that would be Tom DeSanto).

The players are in place. The next step is for them to gauge the interest in such an endeavor by the viewing public. If sufficient interest is there, a studio just might pony up the cash necessary.

Complications? Of course - there always are. If there is a series of episodes based on the mini universe, that would complicate things. Schedules of the principals have to be coordinated, and they're busy people. Studio execs (never known for thier risk-taking) have to be sold on the whole idea. There's no such thing as a Hollywood "done deal" until the project is released or aired.

And, we may never see such a production - but the final decision has not been made, and won't be made for quite some time. Forgive me (and those like me) if we would rather make some effort to show there is interest, than whine that it will never happen and throw up our hands and walk away - nothing is ever accomplished by taking that attitude. We prefer a positive attitude: we do not believe the time to walk away is upon us, and may never be upon us - only time will tell.

If, however, you and Dogface feel such efforts are wasted and it's time to walk away, please do so.

You go with my blessings, and the blessings of the Lords of Kobol.



I am
Dawg

[amberstar]

And, we may never see such a production - but the final decision has not been made, and won't be made for quite some time. Forgive me (and those like me) if we would rather make some effort to show there is interest, than whine that it will never happen and throw up our hands and walk away - nothing is ever accomplished by taking that attitude. We prefer a positive attitude: we do not believe the time to walk away is upon us, and may never be upon us - only time will tell.

I believe as you do Dawg. We have to remain positive, after all the negative that has been thrown our way we can still fight for what we want.
We were sooooo close with DeSanto before 9-11 took place and I truly think the dream is not lost. It may take two years as Glen has stated but I think a continuation would be profit to the powers that be.
Profit is what they are looking at.
Anyway I'm not walking away, I choose to "Keep the Faith".

Amber

[Soulmage]

Originally posted by Dawg
[B]And just where did you get your crystal ball, Soulmage?

Wall-Mart is rolling back prices on them. In fact. . . here comes the little guy now. . .:walmart:

There is a chance for a continuation but it will only happen if SCIFI does not greenlight the mini based series. The mini proved there is an audience out there still. If there is no green light anyone could make any version of Battlestar Galactica next.

If what we hear is true and SCIFI does greenlight a series all efforts on a continuation are finished. It's not what many want to hear but it is business reality.

I am not anti-continuation but I realize that as a business failure is not going to give birth to a second chance. We are lucky BSG80 didn't kill us already.

[Dawg]

Originally posted by antelope526
There is a chance for a continuation but it will only happen if SCIFI does not greenlight the mini based series. The mini proved there is an audience out there still. If there is no green light anyone could make any version of Battlestar Galactica next.

If what we hear is true and SCIFI does greenlight a series all efforts on a continuation are finished. It's not what many want to hear but it is business reality.

I am not anti-continuation but I realize that as a business failure is not going to give birth to a second chance. We are lucky BSG80 didn't kill us already.

You're right, in that any decision, one way or another, will be a business decision. Nobody will make a movie they think they'll lose money on.

However I do not see a greenlight of a series based on the mini as being the death knell for a continuation. What the decision will be based on is the interest there is for the movie.

That's why we can't just sit on our hands bemoaning the mini, whether a series is greenlighted or not, or our own perceptions of how Hollywood works. The only way a movie will be made is if the suits believe there is money to be made, and that means they need to know that we'll pay to see it. The only way they'll know that is if we tell them.

Only when they look at the audience and what we tell them will we see if Battlestar Galactica lives, or is destined to live only in our hearts and minds. Not before.

I am
Dawg

[Darth Marley]

If the RDM product goes to series,then BSG lives.

[Dawg]

Originally posted by Darth Marley
If the RDM product goes to series,then BSG lives.

"That is one opinion. It does not happen to be mine."



I am
Dawg

The mini proved the audience. We don't need to tell THEM anything. They know. The question now is how will THEY proceed. The hand is heavily stacked in favor of the mini universe. If the mini universe does not go to series or more minis made money will eventually reach some other Battlestar Galactica project. If the mini goes to series the "Battlestar money" in the Hollywood universe is going there. If the new series makes money no one will have any reason to finance other projects when the current version is a proven success. If we get anything beyond a new series it will be new movies based on the mini universe just like the STTNG movies once the series ended. If a new series based on the mini universe fails Battlestar Galactica as a money making venture will have failed. Although we pretend BSG1980 didn't exist I assure you the accountants know it did. So at this point the shakey Battlestar financial record is "Saga of a Star World" - Success, Series #1 - Marginal success, Series #2 (or dare I say Continuation #1) - Failure, Miniseries - Success (maybe marginal success). Right now the franchise is on life support after someone found a dead body with a heart beat in the Hollywood morgue. If SCIFI or anyone else knew for sure Battlestar would be a success they would have already funded it.

No one will fund DeSantos or any one else if the mini universe Battlestar series fails. If the series succeeds why would anyone gamble on DeSantos when they could make a mini based movie with a pretty much guaranteed return?

If a mini series is made and last a couple years maybe they can dust off DeSantos script in 2014 and make a continuation/reunion movie of the cast of TTS (The third series-we'll call it TSS<the second series> since we still won't admit BSG1980 ever happened.

The wars over man Wermer dropped the big one.

What.........? Over........? Over.........? Nothing is over until we decide it is. Was it over when the Germans bombed pearl harbor. Hell No!

Germans?

Forget it hes rolling!

And it aint over now! Cause when to going gets tough............................................................................................................................................................................................The tough get going. So who's with me, let's go, come on heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!





My name is not important but if you must know human...........I am called

Slartibartfast

[Sci-Fi]

From the main page of another BSG site:

Most fans of the original series found the new Mini a waste of time, while those who didn't care for, or never saw the original seemed to like it. Whatever your view, it's over, it's aired, lets move on and just be fans of Battlestar Galactica.

IMHO, if you like the Mini and/or TOS, then by all means support the various efforts (Mini going to series, TOS continuation movie/series, revivals, etc.). But please don't go beating up on each other or conduct negative campaigns to essentially destroy what other people like, worked hard for, or supported for years. Express your opinions but keep it civil (no flame wars or conversion efforts).

[peter noble]

If Battlestar Galactica teaches us anything, and I mean Battlestar Galactica the Classic series, is that there's always hope in the darkest of times, and that there is strength of purpose in living to fight another day.

That's why I continue to believe in the timeless message of Battlestar Galactica, and that one day she will fly again across the big silver screen, despite the efforts of people who want to destroy my fandom and those who don't believe in the values of family and friendship and service and self-sacrifice as laid down by the show.

I don't deny people their right to like the new mini-series, but just for the record we, the original fans, aren't going away any time soon and we'll continue to fight for the dream we've had for 25+ years.

There are still those who believe that life here, began out there...

Peter

[SAR Pilot]

Originally posted by Dawg

The only way a movie will be made is if the suits believe there is money to be made, and that means they need to know that we'll pay to see it. The only way they'll know that is if we tell them.

Who is the "we" you refer to that will pay to see it? I am not asking for a defensive reaction, and I am definately not trying to start any fights! Antelope has a point, whether the "true" TOS fans are willing to read objectively. . . exclusive of personal desires. (I put true in quotes to represent all of the folks who have lumped fans of both iterations together with fans of the mini alone.)
Exclusive of the BSG fans, TOS and RDM, will the casual viewer (read the majority of the movie-going public) want to go see a movie which requires a familiarity with a plot and characters that are 25 years old, older than a large portion of the viewing public? Yes, there are DVDs that people can view, but when the younger folks consider something only a few years old as too old to bother with, what then?
I am not asking anyone to give up the dream, for I too would love a continuation movie. Nor am I asking anyone to throw in the towel. THis is all about a business decision, and as much as it pains me to think it, unless an RDM series or other mini-series is not picked up or bombs, there is little room in this CURRENT environment for a TOS continuation. Why? Because the viewing public, the majority, will be more intimately familiar with the RDM universe since it is fresh in their minds. That is sad, but unfortunately true. And where the majority of money will come from is the audience any big screen production company will target for the most bang for its buck.
We, the true fans, all want to see as much BSG as possible. Some will only accept a TOS universe, some will only accept an RDM universe, and a good number will accept both. I think it is safe to say, and anybody out there please feel free to correct me if I am wrong, that almost all of the mini fans here are also fans of TOS. As such, we don't want to see anything fade into the past with a fizzle.
With that said, we all need to continue pursuing all avenues of BSG with a furor and a vigor never before seen to tell the PTB that we are here and strong. . . but we must also be able to adapt as when we age, things change and we modify our views to reflect the change. Both sides can find a middle ground and bring excellent ideas to any future BSG projects, but we have to start working together to make it happen.

Now, to go fly!

[Dawg]

"We", SAR, are the people who want to see a continuation movie. Some of us have taken the step of communicating with the people who would head up such a production to express our desire. You can, too, if you want to go to the effort of doing so; the addresses are available here.

Exclusive of the BSG fans, TOS and RDM, will the casual viewer (read the majority of the movie-going public) want to go see a movie which requires a familiarity with a plot and characters that are 25 years old, older than a large portion of the viewing public? Yes, there are DVDs that people can view, but when the younger folks consider something only a few years old as too old to bother with, what then?

Here, my friend, you sound really patronizing, which I'm sure you didn't intend. I'm going to assume you don't really think I am really that dense. Mssrs. Larson and DeSanto certainly aren't.

No movie is going to just dump you into a universe with established characters and storyline (unless there is at least one prior movie set in the same universe). There would be a period at the beginning where the storyline is established, including enough of the "back story" to bring the viewer pretty much up to speed. This is basic to storytelling, SAR - do you tell your kids the Hansel and Gretel story beginning at the point they are caged by the witch?

I think it is safe to say, and anybody out there please feel free to correct me if I am wrong, that almost all of the mini fans here are also fans of TOS. As such, we don't want to see anything fade into the past with a fizzle.

Consider yourself corrected. Yes, there are a few TOS fans who enjoyed the mini. But, if you read most of the posts from the most vocal of the "mini fans", you'll see that they tend to demean TOS ("campy", "out-dated", other generally negative comments) and call the mini a "fresh start" and "much better" than TOS. I do not count them as fans of TOS, protests to the contrary notwithstanding. I think most of the genuine TOS fans who also enjoyed the mini did so viewing the mini as a separate production, not as "Battlestar Galactica."

I hope you're not offended by that. I still have a very hard time reconciling the idea that a "real fan" of TOS BSG could even remotely consider the mini as BSG. That's just me, though; perhaps a failing on my part....

The balance of your words I tend to agree with, for the most part; it is now down to the suits to make the choices that will garner them the most profit. The influence we, as fans, might have is limited to the volume of letters, the attendance at cons, and all the other intangibles we really don't have control over. We do need to continue to voice our support to TPTB for more BSG (preferably the right one.... )

(BTW, well said, Peter. I agree 100%!)

I am
Dawg

When Moore says (which he has) that he would like to redo "Living Legend" I dream that a series will have many of the best elements of TOS. We already see the introduction of the religious theme, a mainstay of some of the better TOS episodes. I think a new series will be a lot closer to TOS than the anti-mini crowd believes. Most TOS episodes are freestanding after all and based on age old themes. I am sure just like the X-files a few stories every few episodes will center around the cylon "enemy within". These will be "cliffhanger" episodes.

Since TOS lasted only one season anything after one season in the mini world is THE CONTINUATION. Anything you wish the future to hold should be suggested to SCIFI, Moore, and the like. I think Battlestar fandom has come up with a few good ideas over the past 25 years.

Right now the mini universe is at almost the same point we were after the Galactica escaped Carillon:

Apollo is the loving son again.
Adama has issues with civilian authority.
Boxey is on board the Galactica.
Baltar is still a plotting sneak.
No Serena but they shot her to death in TOS and guess what...Apollo fond a hot female viper pilot where the chemistry was obviously on the way named Sheba (maybe "Starbuck" is really "Sheba"?)
No TOS Starbuck but we seem to have found a CPO Tyrol who seems a bit wild and may just fill the role just fine.
No Athena or Cassiopea but we do have the new Boomer, Calley, and that girl in CIC (forgot her name). Something tells me we will have the love triangle coming out of this somewhere.
Colonel Tigh is different but to be honest the original Boomer, Tigh, and Jolly were all peripheral support characters.

Moore did his best to give us an exciting story to start a franchise. Most of us (pro-mini) think that "Saga of a Star World" was hurting once the casino planet story started. I am sure Moore thought so too. He had to come up with a proven 3 hour (4 hours with commercials) script to catch the viewer. Instead of rewriting the second half of "Saga of a Star World" he pulled out a classic movie that was a proven success and luckily already 2 hours and 40 minutes long, "In Harm's Way". He gave us some good characters and also a bunch of peripheral characters who can be cut depending on the budget of a series.

We can have the dream again if you don't have it now. Instead of writing to kill Battlestar, if you feel a need to write tell them what you want and obviously don't say you want a 60 year old Apollo. I look forward to finding the Pegasus again, getting past the gun on the ice planet, and finding out what was beyond Terra.

[jewels]

Originally posted by antelope526
[B](maybe "Starbuck" is really "Sheba"?)

Er. I've met Anne Lockhart. Best you wash your mouth out with soap before one of the boys takes you on over that! If you think (or have heard) that Dirk has class, try tripling his and you'd approach Anne's. Incredible lady, totally sweet, incredible actress. Kara does not even come close to Sheba. Save for piloting ability.

[jewels]

Moore told us at Galacticon that he isn't interested in our input.

I love Sheba and of course I don't think the current Starbuck measures up but I think her character is more Sheba at the start of "Living Legend" than Starbuck at the end of "Saga of a Star World". No Serena puts the Apollo relationship at the same point also. Starbuck's love, Zack is just as dead and fresh in mind as Bojay (sp?) an episode after "Living Legend".

Moore talks about "Living Legend" so he is taking some input from TOS and/or fans. Being how Moore and team have been so hammered by the Galactica fan base I can see how he could have made such a statement. When you tell someone you hate what their doing it's hard to believe they'll listen to much else you'll say. I don't want to defend Moore but if anyone is reading what fans say I would give them some help and advice. They can take it or leave it. If you truely believe no one cares on the mini team what the fans think why bother writing anything.

I don't know the answer to this so if anybody does let me know: Moore supposedly worked on Star Trek? If so did Star Trek ever listen to the fans? Do any of these projects listen to the fans? What does it mean to listen to the fans? Why does SCIFI have a BBoard if they don't want to hear what people are saying? Why would Moore go to Galacticon if he hates the fans? I know Moore is portrayed as Count Ibbly but I wonder if anyone remade the original would we be happy. I have seen people write they don't like the DeSanto continuation either. I know no one liked the original continuation (BSG1980). I think TOS might be like a long lost love taken prematurely. No one no matter how good will ever measure up.

Remember the "silent majority". It is very rare that the most vocal critics reflect the views of society in general. I think the biggest fan they are listening to is Mr. Nielsen. I don't know what he is telling them.

Please realize no harshness intended. Remember I have a dream! It may turn into a nightmare. But as of tonight I lay my head down with visions of sugarplums dancing in my head.

[Dawg]

Originally posted by antelope526
When Moore says (which he has) that he would like to redo "Living Legend" I dream that a series will have many of the best elements of TOS. We already see the introduction of the religious theme, a mainstay of some of the better TOS episodes. I think a new series will be a lot closer to TOS than the anti-mini crowd believes. Most TOS episodes are freestanding after all and based on age old themes. I am sure just like the X-files a few stories every few episodes will center around the cylon "enemy within". These will be "cliffhanger" episodes.

Remember, antelope, you're talking to a "real" TOS fan, here. Hard-core. So please don't take personal offense at my responses, since they are coming from my perspective of the TOS vs. mini debate.

So, to begin: Tell me, how could follow-up episodes to the mini be "closer to TOS" when there's so pitifully little of TOS to be found in the mini?

Also, with the rare exceptions (like 24), all series television is stand-alone individual episodes (or multi-part episodes). "Cliffhangers" are end of season (or "end of part one") episodes. In the case of the mini, the "enemy within" episodes have no comparison to TOS BSG, since there were no "sleeper Cylons" in TOS.

Originally posted by antelope526
Since TOS lasted only one season anything after one season in the mini world is THE CONTINUATION. Anything you wish the future to hold should be suggested to SCIFI, Moore, and the like. I think Battlestar fandom has come up with a few good ideas over the past 25 years.

I'll certainly agree with the last sentence there. Wow, all that fanfic, etc!

As for the rest of it, forgive me, but I could not disagree more. If (and it is still "if") a series is green-lighted, it will "continue" the mini. "THE CONTINUATION" you're refering to is, in my mind, the TOS BSG universe, not the mini's.

Originally posted by antelope526
Right now the mini universe is at almost the same point we were after the Galactica escaped Carillon:

Apollo is the loving son again.
Adama has issues with civilian authority.
Boxey is on board the Galactica.
Baltar is still a plotting sneak.
No Serena but they shot her to death in TOS and guess what...Apollo fond a hot female viper pilot where the chemistry was obviously on the way named Sheba (maybe "Starbuck" is really "Sheba"?)
No TOS Starbuck but we seem to have found a CPO Tyrol who seems a bit wild and may just fill the role just fine.
No Athena or Cassiopea but we do have the new Boomer, Calley, and that girl in CIC (forgot her name). Something tells me we will have the love triangle coming out of this somewhere.
Colonel Tigh is different but to be honest the original Boomer, Tigh, and Jolly were all peripheral support characters.

These are things we'll have to agree to disagree about, mostly. But I do think Tigh and Boomer were pretty central TOS characters (certainly not the mains, but important).

Originally posted by antelope526
Moore did his best to give us an exciting story to start a franchise. Most of us (pro-mini) think that "Saga of a Star World" was hurting once the casino planet story started. I am sure Moore thought so too. He had to come up with a proven 3 hour (4 hours with commercials) script to catch the viewer. Instead of rewriting the second half of "Saga of a Star World" he pulled out a classic movie that was a proven success and luckily already 2 hours and 40 minutes long, "In Harm's Way". He gave us some good characters and also a bunch of peripheral characters who can be cut depending on the budget of a series.

(FYI, I think you'll find most TOS fans aren't too fond of the Carillon part of Saga, either.)

Oh, my! You've hit an important point here, antelope, and I hope everybody's paying attention.

I quote: "Instead of rewriting the second half of "Saga of a Star World" he pulled out a classic movie that was a proven success and luckily already 2 hours and 40 minutes long, "In Harm's Way"."

Dear Lords! What was he doing re-writing "In Harm's Way"? Moore was supposed to be writing "Battlestar Galactica"!!!

(Um, sorry about that . Got a bit excited.)

But do you see my point?

Oh, and I disagree about him giving us an "exciting story", but that's in the eye of the beholder, too.

Originally posted by antelope526
We can have the dream again if you don't have it now. Instead of writing to kill Battlestar, if you feel a need to write tell them what you want and obviously don't say you want a 60 year old Apollo. I look forward to finding the Pegasus again, getting past the gun on the ice planet, and finding out what was beyond Terra. [/B]

I'm not writing to kill Battlestar. Moore's doing a fine job of that all by himself and doesn't need anybody's help. I'm writing to save it.

In other words, antelope, we obviously disagree on some of the basic points in the TOS vs. mini debate. I think, if we were to sit down and analyze it, though, that we could come up with a lot of common ground, too, that we could both support whole-heartedly. I'm glad to see that, frankly.

Thanks for giving me the opportunity to present another viewpoint. See 'ya round the campus.

I am
Dawg

[Dawg]

Originally posted by antelope526
I don't know the answer to this so if anybody does let me know: Moore supposedly worked on Star Trek? If so did Star Trek ever listen to the fans? Do any of these projects listen to the fans? What does it mean to listen to the fans? Why does SCIFI have a BBoard if they don't want to hear what people are saying? Why would Moore go to Galacticon if he hates the fans? I know Moore is portrayed as Count Ibbly but I wonder if anyone remade the original would we be happy. I have seen people write they don't like the DeSanto continuation either. I know no one liked the original continuation (BSG1980). I think TOS might be like a long lost love taken prematurely. No one no matter how good will ever measure up.

Just real quick - ST does - or at least did - listen to its fans. Through Voyager, they accepted spec scripts, and, believe it or not, that's how Moore got his start - a fan script they bought.

Too bad he doesn't remember....

I am
Dawg

[jewels]

antelope, I just wanted you warned that some would not take well, that comparison of Sheba to Kara (her name is not Starbuck--just don't even bug me on that one: it keeps it clearer for me, plus it keeps me from being mad. You never want me mad. Believe me, it's a good thing I didn't run into Ron Moore Dec. of 2002. I like my playboy pilot--Starbuck just as much as I like my family man who's got to do the hero thing even if it gets him killed--Apollo.

There is a critical difference between Sheba and Kara: Sheba, even under the influence of Iblis, was never a _______(place another word for a female breeding dog in the blank).

That doesn't mean I want your dream bashed. Just means I have tons more respect for Sheba and Kara has much growing to do in my book before they could be compared.

[Darth Marley]

We wont get the heads up comparision of the RDM Sheba character until he does a "Living Legend" plot.

Little new is added in these discussions. A few attacks questioning matters of taste are just a difference of opinion.
I am left wondering just who are the dark forces attacking fandom,friendship, and family values though. Certainly one can prefer the RDM product and have freinds,family values, and support fandom, just flying under a different flag.

I questioned elsewhere regarding the wholesale copying of "In Harm's Way" that Star Wars also ripped off other films,should fans of that product insist Lucas go back and purify that?
TOS lifted stories from religious beliefs,does the same critique apply?